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 Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365

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PostSubject: Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365   Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 Icon_minitimeMon Jul 21, 2008 1:03 pm

In flower today, 6-5-08. Location... East of Gilo growing on volcanic rocks.

Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 2pplptt

In the BCSS journal (no 1, 2088, page36) the Fitz Maurice's state that the plants from Gilo, Hidalgo are ' the frequently cited imposter ' and are only forms of M.crinita. The TL of M.glochidiata is the Barranca Toliman about 60km away from Gilo.
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PostSubject: Re: Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365   Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 Icon_minitimeMon Jul 21, 2008 1:13 pm

For the Fitz Maurice's is everything crinita, Tam.Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 Emo_smile

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PostSubject: Re: Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365   Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 Icon_minitimeMon Jul 21, 2008 1:15 pm

They have been working on the series Stylothelae in habitat for the last 20 years, inculding DNA sampling. I would think that qualifies them to say that they know what they are talking about in this instance. Any way they do recoginze M.glochidiata has a species all they are saying is that the plants from around Gilo are not M.glochidiata.
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PostSubject: Re: Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365   Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 Icon_minitimeMon Jul 21, 2008 1:15 pm

This my glochidiata Rep 2148 and this came from Barranca Xilitla around Gilo. It match very well the first picture shown in Pilbeam's book. A xiloensis is a totally different plant. The second picture is taken at Plein's collection. Mention the flower colour

Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 2wdopcl

Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 1zlc2gl

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PostSubject: Re: Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365   Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 Icon_minitimeMon Jul 21, 2008 1:17 pm

The second picture certainly looks like the true M.glochidiata. Where has it come from has I don't think Rog or Plein have collected M.glochidata themsevles. Your Rep plant looks petty much like any other M.crinita to me, what colour flower is it.
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PostSubject: Re: Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365   Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 Icon_minitimeMon Jul 21, 2008 1:18 pm

Exactly the same colour as Plein's plant.

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PostSubject: Re: Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365   Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 Icon_minitimeMon Jul 21, 2008 1:19 pm

Well then, a pink flowering M.crinita from near Gilo.
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PostSubject: Re: Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365   Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 Icon_minitimeMon Jul 21, 2008 1:20 pm

So, a pink flowering crinita from Gilo. And what do you think about this plant? glochidiata or crinita?

Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 2it511y

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PostSubject: Re: Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365   Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 Icon_minitimeMon Jul 21, 2008 1:21 pm

What a pretty flower colour. My glochidiata certainly isn;t that pink, this is more like my plant of variabilis R1393.
I hope I haven't confused things by bringing in this plant to the discussion. I find that the Stylothelae is difficult in the extreme to identify properly. If you believe the Fitz-Maurices then almost anything is crinita, but I am sure that this is a lump to far. I know they have spent longer looking at crinita / Stylothelae plants than probably anyone. But I do feel that thye have fallen into the trap that seems to befall all observers of variable species - where to draw the line - and they've drawn it very high up the evolution history of these plants. That is their choice, but as we know full well, there are no absolutes in this game.
We were talking about just this as a committee meeting I attended on Sunday, and there was a very strong feeling that Fitz had gonbe too far. You can understand why he has, but by the same book, we'd probably have about 3 species of the Supertextae, 3 or 4 of the Polyedrae...etc...
Variability is something we know is a part of the living world. But in this world no-one is right, some may be more right than others, but each has a valid point. Lets concentrate on the plants....and cherish the differences.

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PostSubject: Re: Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365   Mammillaria glochidiata xiloensis WTH365 Icon_minitimeMon Jul 21, 2008 1:23 pm

Thats a great plant Hugo and I would be very happy to see it sitting on my bench. I am more than happy for you to belive that the plants from around Gilo are a variety of glochidiata has per Reppenhagen. For me I will go with the Fitz Maurices 20 years exprience for now. May be they will change thier minds in the future, you never can tell.
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